Is there such a thing as an untrainable dog?
Oct 30, 2009 08:58 PM 12 comments, below
Categories: Training
We have a very smart and stubborn dog that seems to outwit us at every turn. We need ideas. She digs and barks and pays very little attention to us when we try to correct her. Ignoring doesn't work, either. Do we need a bark collar?
babette says,
What motivates her--other than digging and barking? Can you use that motivation to get her attention? Toys? Train her when she is hungry--I used the citronella collar on Lagsi--worked 12 hours. I would prefer Not to use the electronic versions for various reasons--mainly the dogs know its on and behave differently --friends do that with their lab puppy and they are the only ones that can walk her--and the collar has to be on her. i felt the same way about the citronella collar. It has taken me 1.5 years to get him "listening" to me when he gets into his barking mode---the most important thing I have learned is to preempt the behavior. Keep her busy/break the cycle of the behavior. Does she get lots of physical exercise? Teach some tricks--catch--to distract from the behavior. Nancy is experienced with barking dogs and I have had some private training sessions with her -- she gave me some good mechanisms--altho the teaching the dog to bark and then not to bark did not work with him. I feel your pain.
Oct 31, 2009 06:48 AM
PocoLoco says,
Poco was found starving on the desert (3 months) and we just couldn't let her be put down. She's very used to doing her own thing -- loves us to pieces -- and the only thing that motivates her is food. We get stuck in the cycle of: bark, go to door and say, "come," she comes, get's a treat for coming (and for barking) -- and what then? We have a good sized yard and if we try to catch her, she thinks it's a game, and if we put her in her crate she's perfectly happy and doesn't seem to make a connection. If we try to go out and play with her she thinks she's "called" us. Sigh!!!!
Nov 1, 2009 07:10 PM
MannerlyMutt says,
Some quick tips, as I am behind in my work today. But these may give you pause for thought:
1. What you can't do on leash, you can't do off leash, generally speaking. So if you still need to "catch" her, then she needs training on something where you can guide her to where you want her when you want her:) It's a little more complex than that, but I will leave you with that thought for now.
2. Dogs that were feral need to be taught from the ground up:) So don't think your progress is too slow, it's going to take some time as you will need to teach her things that a shelter, breeder, or other home would have started her on. She may never have had the luxury of that earlier education.
3. Timing and when you reward is so crucial. It's so easy to teach a dog to speak by accident, when trying to teach them the command quiet. Having a long line on her when she goes running for the door could help you time a "come towards me" before she is able to get a bark out, and then treat her.
4. If a trainer isn't there to help you, don't be afraid to think outside the box! It sounds like play, for instance, is as good a motivator as food. So many times when clients even have the commands down, they forget that "down" can be used in the car to see outside the back window...it's not just something that happens in your kitchen on occaision. As a trainer, and before that an owner without a clue, I had to occaisionally feel around in the dark to find the solution. Like I said, you don't have any aggressive things happening, so it's not a life or death emergency.
The things you are talking about are quite common in dogs, so don't panic LOL. It's hard, but be sure that you don't get frustrated during training. It can be fun to watch the progress. Dog training can add a lot of well need patience AND appreciation of life to your life!!
Good luck, and let me know if any of that gives you any ideas.
Nov 3, 2009 01:17 PM
ChessieMom says,
An e-collar is a very effective training device, BUT if you use an e-collar, you need to go through a collar conditioning program with the dog before beginning its use... or the dog will be collar wise. It can't be something you put on and take off at the time of misbehavior. That being said, no one should use an e-collar without learning how it works (i.e. working with a professional trainer). Tritronics has great training seminars. It isn't about "burning" or otherwise hurting the dog, and it can be used humanely... don't buy a cheap one that can't be appropriately set for the individual dog. My husband's old Chesapeake would fetch his e-collar if he thought it was time for field training... he associated it with all things wonderful about birds and retrieving rather than with any sort of negative connotation because it was used correctly in his training along with positive reinforcement methods.
Nov 6, 2009 10:07 AM
MannerlyMutt says,
And remember that a "bark collar" is quite different than a remote electric collar. On a bark collar, YOU have no control over the correction. Also if you just strap it on a dog and go, it could cause all sorts of problems.
It sounds like regular old low tech methods would work though.
Nov 7, 2009 10:05 AM
MannerlyMutt says,
Depending on your definition of "trainable", sure there are untrainable dogs. Medical issues, unsuitable temperament...still could be trainable, but if you are talking about guaranteeing a sound balanced dog for every single dog out there as a definition of trainable, then no.
If you question is can you train your dog...sounds like you have a normal dog. Of course they can be trained, but a correction in and by itself is by no means training. Many commands and a concrete plan of action will make your relationship with your dog much more enjoyable. Due to your progress to date, you should probably enlist some qualified and professional help to mostly train YOU to properly train your dog.
Oct 31, 2009 10:07 AM
PocoLoco says,
We are making some progress with a trainer who is not as available as we would like. She will sit, lay down, come (mostly), and stay (improving with age). We know we need to be trained. Maybe we are the untrainables!!
Nov 1, 2009 07:12 PM
MannerlyMutt says,
LOL, at least you are trying. If it's not aggression that you are worrying about, you do have some time to figure things out, if there is no trainer out there in the booney docks!!
I'll see if I can think of some quick things tomorrow for what you posted above.
Nov 2, 2009 07:39 PM
MannerlyMutt says,
Depending on your definition of "trainable", sure there are untrainable dogs. Medical issues, unsuitable temperament...still could be trainable, but if you are talking about guaranteeing a sound balanced dog for every single dog out there as a definition of trainable, then no.
If you question is can you train your dog...sounds like you have a normal dog. Of course they can be trained, but a correction in and by itself is by no means training. Many commands and a concrete plan of action will make your relationship with your dog much more enjoyable. Due to your progress to date, you should probably enlist some qualified and professional help to mostly train YOU to properly train your dog.
Oct 31, 2009 10:07 AM
babette says,
if you can train her to do some things, but not others, then yes, she is trainable. its just that somehow you are not able to get her to give up two things that she realllllly, reallllly, wants to do. Trainers can help you get over the hump. Trust me, it does help.
Nov 1, 2009 01:17 PM
PocoLoco says,
Thanks. Maybe we need to find a trainer who is more available. We live in the williwags and that ain't easy! Poco is having a wonderful time and we just can't get too mad at her. I'm still thinking we're the old dogs that have trouble learning the new tricks.
Nov 1, 2009 07:15 PM
babette says,
i don't know which williwags you live in, but if at first you don't succeed. Seriously, i was lost with a puppy who's response to the world was to bark--and when barking-- nothing else existed, nada. I used to sit on the floor at nite and cry. i actually have worked with Dogsenseme.com and nancy to get training tips for him. Check out the web sites for both and if Dogsenseme is nearby you--also trains in Fryeburg, so maybe that is an option. You are correct---we old dogs need to be able to think outside the box. Keeping a line (leash) on her--even inside is something that can be extremely helpful. playing with her can be a reward. Train her on leash, then proof off. Work on focus and attention. Don't leave toys around--all things come from you, hand feed her--make her work for her food--maybe only if its kibble. lagsi had to earn every morsel. I used to work on focus and impulse control with him every day. Short bursts--a.m. meal, p.m. meal--all from me. its been hard and long for me, but we have made progress---you probably have too, but it sounds as though you are 'stuck' and need some guidance. Good luck.
Nov 3, 2009 07:22 PM


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